Saturday, October 10, 2015

Christianity at Ein Karem

Ein Karem -- Church of Visitation

As everyone knows we had an interesting and fun tiul to the familiar neighborhood of Ein Karem. Aside from it's super awesome ice cream and pretty views, there's a rich history that comes aong with it. A large part of that is the fact that in the second temple period Ein Karem was a successful farming village. Before we went to see The Church of Visitation it was nice to sit outside near the garden we worked on just a few weeks before and learn about Jesus's early life. We learned about how he was born in Bethlehem although his family lived in Nazareth, his parents were Miriam and Joseph and whether he was immaculately or normally concieved was an argument between Matthew and Luke in the biblical period and is still an exisiting argument. We also learned that he went missing for three whole days and when he was found, he was found right here in Jerusalem arguing with Rabbis and asking questions, showing that he was already ahead of his time.

At the church that we visited, one of the first things we saw were the statues of the two pregnant woman. We learned that the two women were Elizabeth and Miriam. The baby that Elizabeth was pregnant with sensed that the messiah was near and it's told that it went a little crazy in her stomach. Its's said that Elizabeth's baby was kicking and moving around during the visit because of it's knowledge about how close it was to such an important figure before that figure was even born.  (That figure being Yeshua Ben Yoseph, later known as Jesus) It was really cool seeing the statue of what we had just learned about and taken notes on because of how real it suddenly makes it.

With this, we learned about John the Baptists and all that he had to do with Jesus's teachings. He was a strong inspiration for Jesus and introduced Baptisism to him and was the one who baptised Jesus in Yam Hamelach. This went on to Jesus's teachings, which was the main event in the tiul. Jesus was a dedicted Jew and took his knowledg, his beliefs, and his specific take on Judaism and spread it all over. He believed in healing people, social justice, and made Judaism a lot more individualized. This eventually became a seperate religion after Jesus died because of the belief of life after death or not.

A Christianity became it's own religion, dropping many Jewish priotities like mitzvot and circumcision, it took off and became appealing to people world wide. We learned about Paul and Peter and their missionary work, and we saw the olive branch stump as we walked down the hill back to the town that symbolizes the Withered Stump Theory, which is that Judaism is an old and out of date religion while Christianity is a new and represents the "truth".

It eventually became that Jews were seen as below christians. This was especially when the Romans all converted to christianity and Father Oregon gave Jews the responsibility for "killing God", accusing us of Dioside. Some Christians like Father Oregon wanted Jews to be gone while there were also people like St. Augustine who wanted Jews to be alive to witness the success of Christianity.

Going to the Chruch of Visitation was an interesting and enlightening experience. Like we talked about when we sat outside after that quick little rain storm, it's sometimes uncomfortable to be in a place of worship that's so different than you're own. Even though temples can be beautiful and breathtaking, churches have a very different feel. There's no religious connection so all you can do is observe and learn, and it was a good experience to do that at Ein Karem. What do you guys think about Withered Stump Theory; do you think it's still true today or not? Also how does being in a place of worship that's not exactly your own religion make you feel?




17 comments:

  1. I feel the withered stump theory is utter flumadiddle. It is the early Christians being arrogant and trying to justify why another religion is "worse" than theirs. I personally believe that if one's religion or any part of one's religion has a basis of ridiculing another, then there religion is the faulty one. So I despise the withered stump theory almost as much as I despise the person who devised it.
    To answer the second question: I love going into all houses of prayer of any religion because I truly find mythology fascinating.

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  2. Being a proud Jew, I disagree with the Withered Stump Theory. As long as I, or anyone really has pride in the Jewish religion, Judaism cannot be "dead". The perspective that Christianity is the "truth" does not resonate with me because I don't believe Jesus was or will be the Messiah. But, it must be noted that while I don't personally identify with Christianity, it is the truth for some people. In regards to entering foreign places of worship, I must say that I love going into empty churches and other houses of worship because I feel that there is a lot to be learned from their symbology and general atmosphere. However, I am not a fan of going into foreign places of worship while they are occupied because I feel like an intruder on the moments that the resident families and members are trying to create in their own community.

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  3. I strongly disagree with the withered stump theory, not because I am Jewish though. In the most literal sense, Jews still exist, we are still a religion, and a religion even with different sects to it. When it comes into going into other places of worship, well that is something I have had to do just because of more secular activities but in a more religious part I do feel not ok with it. I feel almost as if I am looking at the religion as if the practiconers or zoo animals, and they arnt and neither are us jews

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  4. I believe the withered stump theory is the spouting off of religious elitists who can't distinguish their own origins. It's clear on both sides that Christianity comes from Judaism, better yet a Jewish man and then they decide that since they think differently than us they're suddenly better and newer so everything about our religious aspects and practices becomes obsolete. It's actually sickening to me how this entire process went. Based on what I had just said you can safely assume I find that whole theory irrelevant as well as my "distaste" of its founder. Being in churches to me is just kind of awkward because I'm not used to it and most of the Christianity I'm familiar with goes largely against my own personal beliefs. To also agree with Max, I enjoy it to some degree because I personally find mythology quite fascinating.

    Fun disclaimer: I'm well aware of my prejudices here however I don't religiously affiliate myself in any way so I just pick which ones are more or less favored.

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  5. I disagree with the withered stump theory because it meant that christianity will continue to grow and judaism is doomed to die off. Yet today the jewish people have their own state where they can freely express themselves with no ruling body over them. As well the jewish people now have some of the smartest people in the world making new scientific innovations every day. Being a very tolerant jew i don't see anything wrong with being in a place of worship for another religion. I believe as long as i do not partake in their worship I'm not recognizing that their religion is right. Therefore i can be a jew and still go into a temple of worship for a different religion.

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  6. The Withered Stump Theory was just another way to promote the Christian religion. It was used to spread Christianity throughout the world. I agree with Max that this theory is "utter flumadiddle". I don't think any proud Jew in modern times would endorse this theory at all. It denounces all of Judaism. To even say something like that shows disrespect and that anyone who says that isn't confident enough in their own religion.
    To enter a different house of prayer is always a very interesting experience for me. I love to see how other religions pray. Especially because most of my school friends from home are Christian, it was cool to see where they pray. I always love to learn about other cultures other than my own.

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  7. I disagree with the wuthered stump theory. I agree that Judaism is a stump, or basis, for many other religions; however, I don't see it as withered. Judaism is still very prominent today, and is continuing to grow and evolve on it's own, through reformed Judaism for example. I enjoyed being in a place of worship for a different religion than my own. I am very interested in how other religions are practiced. I like to explore the similarities and differences between Judaism.

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  8. I completely disagree with the withered stump theory. Christianity and Judaism are simply different religions with similar basises. With this theory, Judaism seems as though it will eventually cease to exist as Christianity thrives and though we are a small religion, we are mighty and intend to grow and prosper. The sects of Judaism are an example of the different "branches" that continue to grow within our religion.

    Being in other places of worship fascinates me. Though I don't intend on worshiping any other gods that appear within these structures, I think it is important to experience a different culture and be open minded to other ideals and morals. Additionally, the churches and mosques and temples I've visited throughout my life are incredibly beautiful, often decorated with magnificent artwork that I love to admire

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  9. I think that while aspects of the withered stump theory may have been valid as the basis of Christianity (i.e., that Christianity is an offshoot of Judaism), the two religions just do not share enough common ground to assert that today. Christianity is its own religion with its own traditions and lore, and the same can be said of Judaism. On a purely theological basis, however, I tend to treat Judaism and Christianity the same. To quote the 13th Apostle Rufus from Kevin Smith's religious comedy Dogma (1999), (referring to Jesus here) "His only real beef with mankind is the s**t that gets carried out in His name. Wars, bigotry, televangelism. The big one, though, is the factioning of all of the religions. He said mankind got it all wrong by taking a good idea and building a belief structure on it." Spirituality is the important thing, and religion is only our physical approach to it. The wars, bigotry and televangelism that Rufus is referring to is all politics.

    As a nonspiritual Jew, it doesn't make much difference to me which house of Hashem I'm in, whether it be a shul or a Catholic church. I've been to many more churches in my life than in synagogues, however, and my favorite moments have always been in churches, not necessarily for their architecture and habit of Avodah Zara but because of some of the traditions that have grown through the Renaissance. Sacred music and artwork from that time period is some of the best in the world. I appreciate Catholicism for its later humanistic aspects, not its spiritual or religious practice.

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  10. I completely disagree with the Withered Stump Theory. I think it’s ridiculous that someone could call us a withered stump with all of the events that have taken place in our history. Unfortunately, I think that this mindset still exists in some people today. They sometimes take advantages of our small moments of weakness and focus on that as a means of persecution and degrading. I did enjoy going into the churches at Ein Karem. I’m the kind of person that although I am totally and undeniably Jewish, I like to be open-minded and learn about other religions. I don’t think that religion should define how we see other people, and I like to have an understanding of how their minds work and how their ideals match up or clash with my own so that I can further connect with them. It doesn’t make me feel comfortable or uncomfortable. Granted, I’m totally confused any time I accompany my non-Jewish friends to their services, but I enjoy the experience and getting to learn about something that isn’t what I’m used to.

    -Rachael Coleman

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  11. I personally don't believe the withered stump theory was ever entirely true. Even though Judaism wasn't as strong as it was in previous times, didn't mean that it was dead. As for the question of being in other religions holy sites, I don't feel that comfortable with it. While I will enter on occasion I try not to stay for too long and generally the reason for me entering was to admire some of the artwork. Even when I do enter, I try not to enter very large ornate churches, for example I recently had the opportunity to enter the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, but opted to stay out due to feeling uncomfortable.

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  12. Seeing as Judaism is still a thriving religion today, the withered stump theory has very little modern bearing. However, it is important to note that Christianity has grown and spread much more than Judaism ever has, although this mostly due to differing views about conversion. Visiting churches is not uncomfortable for me at all. In fact, I enjoy it because of the artwork and architecture.

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  13. Judaism is a withered stump, cut off from God and never able to regrow. The Jews were kept alive to witness the thriving Christian religion, yet Judaism is still so prominent in the world today, which made me proud to be a Jew. Being in other places of worship fascinates me. Though I don't intend on worshiping any other gods that appear within these structures, I think it is important to experience a different culture and be open minded to other ideals and morals. I really enjoyed learning about other religions in comparison to Judaism.

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  14. Excellent post Sarah, and fascinating comments guys!!
    I would just like to add that we ended our tiyul with the story of Vatican II, when Pope John the 23rd (Josepi) addressed a Jewish delegation with the words: "I am Joseph your brother". The famous document "Nostre Aetate" (In our age) which was later published by the Vatican (1965) recognized that the Jews of modern times should no longer be blamed for the death of Jesus and promoted peaceful relations between the different religions.

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  15. I disagree with The Withered Stump Theory because of the fact that Judaism continues to grow and evolve today. Establishing Israel as the homeland for the Jewish people proves that we have not withered or stopped growing. I enjoy exploring where other religions go to pray because of its art and beauty but I start to feel a little uncomfortable if there is a service going on. I would like to sit and learn in a different kind of service to compare other beliefs to Judaism but I always feel the most at home when I am in my synagogue.

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